Thoughts about Manufactory, after 6 months

[DocHolliday]

It's been six months since the manufactory entered the game, and I want to share some thoughts after all the changes it has brought to the game.
let me start by saying that in my opinion it is an excellent addition to the game, very interesting with beautiful graphics and also the fact that the "luck" factor that dominates the museum and the council is missing makes it a very "honorable" idea.

what disappoints me somehow is the following:

I expected that this new addition would open up new avenues in the game, namely that more troop combos would be more efficient and there would be more diversity.

unfortunately, it turns out that exactly the opposite happened
before the manufactory helicopters, mortar/siege and fighters/bombers were the three dominant combos.

moreover, even the helicopters have become very weak, in front of all these protected/antibetrayed tanks that are really too strong.

especially in bases from perk23 alliances, the number of defending tanks is unreal.

Of course, this has something to do with the fact that now the defender spawn time has dropped to very low times with so many bonuses that a defender can collect.

an average defense base has about 40-50% dst from the council alone.

additional -5sec from the munitions

additional dst from directives, perks, acropolis, etc.
and finally the museum.

now only mortars can be countered against all these defenders!

Of course there are also helicopter attacks that bring good results but to do this you need premium TTs, recons and extra buildings. because without these very simply, they get stuck and die in front of the defending tanks.

but what about all the other troops in the game?
they simply have no hope for serious defensive bases.

i played for almost two years with mortar /siege / apc with good results. but I'm really bored with them for so long and I'm looking to find a different combo that can be somehow effective and fun. Suddenly can't.

Some ideas that could help the game to have more diversity:

1: drones! defensive drone is an excellent tool for defense but on the other hand the offensive is unacceptable.

most players just throw it into the base to activate any gci! let's make it more useful...

2: troop, air troop and war tactics capacity

we have the same air capacity since Atomic age! I think I don't need to say anything else..

we also have the same war tactic & troop capacity from the digital age.

I think this should be fixed.

The bases have grown quite a bit after all these years, but the army you can bring into battle has remained the same for a long time.

3:Τhe manufactory greatly strengthened almost every aspect of the defense of the bases (e.g. for the bunkers you can assign the emergency alert system, rapid deployment radio and additionally HTE rounds and communication relay on the HTs that spawn from them! maybe its too much ??) the same of course applies to the tank depots, garrison and rocket arsenal.

additional +1 range on all firing buildings.

after all this, wouldn't it be a good idea to have munitions for the generals as well so that they can "hold" more in the battles as silo bait but also become a little more useful?

4: also something else:
the fact that two war tactics were rendered useless (sabotage and betrayal are almost useless in auto age since you basically cannot use them) is something that should probably be corrected.

for example, instead of being canceled by the defensive drone, the sabotage could be set to have a reduced duration and affect only one building, not a "group" of buildings.

on the other hand, betrayal instead of not being able to be applied at all for a while, could be applied but the betrayed troop has -50% dmg & hp in relation to normal.

5:
One last thing.

Heavy tanks, bazookas, machine guns, MRLs and attack helicopters I believe urgently need reinforcement against defending tanks. they just have no luck with the current data.

Are ok against buildings but really weak and useless against defending tanks. *
(the machine gun troops need a total rework I think)

@Harlems369th

 

[vijaye.r]

Agree with many of your points. The thing I hate about dominations is it is bit one sided. Couple of troops, tactics, wonders, nations are very strong. But all others in their respective categories are not even average and tends to be weak. There needs to be balance. This will help people adopting different strategies and try new things. Once such balance is achieved this game will be super fun.
At this time, the game doesn’t need new artifacts or counselors (though I understood it’s a way for them to make money).

 

[Missvixen]

It's been six months since the manufactory entered the game, and I want to share some thoughts after all the changes it has brought to the game.
let me start by saying that in my opinion it is an excellent addition to the game, very interesting with beautiful graphics and also the fact that the "luck" factor that dominates the museum and the council is missing makes it a very "honorable" idea.

what disappoints me somehow is the following:

I expected that this new addition would open up new avenues in the game, namely that more troop combos would be more efficient and there would be more diversity.

unfortunately, it turns out that exactly the opposite happened
before the manufactory helicopters, mortar/siege and fighters/bombers were the three dominant combos.

moreover, even the helicopters have become very weak, in front of all these protected/antibetrayed tanks that are really too strong.

especially in bases from perk23 alliances, the number of defending tanks is unreal.

Of course, this has something to do with the fact that now the defender spawn time has dropped to very low times with so many bonuses that a defender can collect.

an average defense base has about 40-50% dst from the council alone.

additional -5sec from the munitions

additional dst from directives, perks, acropolis, etc.
and finally the museum.

now only mortars can be countered against all these defenders.

* and of course the planes since they don't even affect them

of course there are also helicopter attacks that bring good results but to do this you need premium TTs, recons and extra buildings. because without these very simply, they get stuck and die in front of the defending tanks.

but what about all the other troops in the game?
they simply have no hope for serious defensive bases.

i played for almost two years with mortar /siege / apc with good results. but I'm really bored with them for so long and I'm looking to find a different combo that can be somehow effective and fun. Suddenly can't.

Some ideas that could help the game to have more diversity:

1: drones! defensive drone is an excellent tool for defense but on the other hand the offensive is unacceptable.

most players just throw it into the base to activate any gci! let's make it more useful...

2: troop, air troop and war tactics capacity

we have the same air capacity since Atomic age! I think I don't need to say anything else..

we also have the same war tactic & troop capacity from the digital age.

I think this should be fixed.

The bases have grown quite a bit after all these years, but the army you can bring into battle has remained the same for a long time.

3:Τhe manufactory greatly strengthened almost every aspect of the defense of the bases (e.g. for the bunkers you can assign the emergency alert system, rapid deployment radio and additionally HTE rounds and communication relay on the HTs that spawn from them! maybe its too much ??) the same of course applies to the tank depots, garrison and rocket arsenal.

additional +1 range on all firing buildings.

after all this, wouldn't it be a good idea to have munitions for the generals as well so that they can "hold" more in the battles as silo bait but also become a little more useful?

4: also something else:
the fact that two war tactics were rendered useless (sabotage and betrayal are almost useless in auto age since you basically cannot use them) is something that should probably be corrected.

for example, instead of being canceled by the defensive drone, the sabotage could be set to have a reduced duration and affect only one building, not a "group" of buildings.

on the other hand, betrayal instead of not being able to be applied at all for a while, could be applied but the betrayed troop has -50% dmg & hp in relation to normal.

5:
One last thing.

Heavy tanks, bazookas, machine guns, MRLs and attack helicopters I believe urgently need reinforcement against defending tanks. they just have no luck with the current data.

it's ok against buildings but really useless against defending tanks. *
(the machine gun troops need a total rework I think)

@Harlems369th

Great suggestions and observations, looking forward, the developers need to listen to these suggestions, the game is getting very stale and boring for long term players.
I think it should be easier to change attacking troop compositions than what it currently is and yeah we’ve worked our butts off raiding etc for years to get to auto age, like the doc said, give us some more troop capacity and tactics space!

 

[nobodyknowsthetrouble]

この投稿は取り下げられました

 

[King Crimson]

Too long but did read.

'before the manufactory helicopters, mortar/siege and fighters/bombers were the three dominant combos'
BHG is part of the problem but the player base should take the lions share of the blame. There are other effective combos to use but, naturally, people use combos that are easiest - and ultimately get lazy. Now that defense has had some significant boosts, players need to think for themselves again.
This is a cycle that has been going on for 9yrs. Use effective combo, get used to it, metas change, learn new combo. Rinse, repeat. Don't just complain, explore other options. They're there - you just need to look.

'i played for almost two years with mortar /siege / apc with good results. but I'm really bored with them for so long and I'm looking to find a different combo that can be somehow effective and fun. Suddenly can't:
You say you're bored yet you're complaining about the extra challenges you're now facing?
Far be it for me to say this sounds like another attacker complaining about strong defence but ... this sounds like just the opportunity you need to make the game less boring.

I can only speak for myself but if you're finding helis are ineffective against HTs then there are options like planes or Betrayal. Betrayal is very effective for me so I'm not sure where they've been nerfed. I especially like protected HTs.

As an attacker l prefer offensive boosts over defense and I've also enjoyed good/easy attacks over the last year or so but now I'm enjoying these more challenging bases. Challenges make us better and force us to try different things. Maybe some people just don't like the latter.
Plus, the defensive boosts work both ways ...

ps: not saying there shouldn't be additions for offense - l would love some more variety in tactics or Generals abilities - just saying there are still options available in the game to combat strong bases.

 

[DocHolliday]

Too long but did read.

'before the manufactory helicopters, mortar/siege and fighters/bombers were the three dominant combos'
BHG is part of the problem but the player base should take the lions share of the blame. There are other effective combos to use but, naturally, people use combos that are easiest - and ultimately get lazy. Now that defense has had some significant boosts, players need to think for themselves again.
This is a cycle that has been going on for 9yrs. Use effective combo, get used to it, metas change, learn new combo. Rinse, repeat. Don't just complain, explore other options. They're there - you just need to look.

'i played for almost two years with mortar /siege / apc with good results. but I'm really bored with them for so long and I'm looking to find a different combo that can be somehow effective and fun. Suddenly can't:
You say you're bored yet you're complaining about the extra challenges you're now facing?
Far be it for me to say this sounds like another attacker complaining about strong defence but ... this sounds like just the opportunity you need to make the game less boring.

I can only speak for myself but if you're finding helis are ineffective against HTs then there are options like planes or Betrayal. Betrayal is very effective for me so I'm not sure where they've been nerfed. I especially like protected HTs.

As an attacker l prefer offensive boosts over defense and I've also enjoyed good/easy attacks over the last year or so but now I'm enjoying these more challenging bases. Challenges make us better and force us to try different things. Maybe some people just don't like the latter.
Plus, the defensive boosts work both ways ...

ps: not saying there shouldn't be additions for offense - l would love some more variety in tactics or Generals abilities - just saying there are still options available in the game to combat strong bases.

Too long but did read.

'before the manufactory helicopters, mortar/siege and fighters/bombers were the three dominant combos'
BHG is part of the problem but the player base should take the lions share of the blame. There are other effective combos to use but, naturally, people use combos that are easiest - and ultimately get lazy. Now that defense has had some significant boosts, players need to think for themselves again.
This is a cycle that has been going on for 9yrs. Use effective combo, get used to it, metas change, learn new combo. Rinse, repeat. Don't just complain, explore other options. They're there - you just need to look.

'i played for almost two years with mortar /siege / apc with good results. but I'm really bored with them for so long and I'm looking to find a different combo that can be somehow effective and fun. Suddenly can't:
You say you're bored yet you're complaining about the extra challenges you're now facing?
Far be it for me to say this sounds like another attacker complaining about strong defence but ... this sounds like just the opportunity you need to make the game less boring.

I can only speak for myself but if you're finding helis are ineffective against HTs then there are options like planes or Betrayal. Betrayal is very effective for me so I'm not sure where they've been nerfed. I especially like protected HTs.

As an attacker l prefer offensive boosts over defense and I've also enjoyed good/easy attacks over the last year or so but now I'm enjoying these more challenging bases. Challenges make us better and force us to try different things. Maybe some people just don't like the latter.
Plus, the defensive boosts work both ways ...

ps: not saying there shouldn't be additions for offense - l would love some more variety in tactics or Generals abilities - just saying there are still options available in the game to combat strong bases.

Well said mate. Its exactly the combo im trying in the recent weeks!
but again, it's a combo that has to do with helicopters. as before.

the only thing I hoped for was that the manufactory would bring new viable options, which it has not brought so far.

HTs, RPGs, MGs, MRLs, assault vehicles, MBTs, Tactical helicopters, etc., remained in obscurity again..

 

[Mahakaal]

It's been six months since the manufactory entered the game, and I want to share some thoughts after all the changes it has brought to the game.
let me start by saying that in my opinion it is an excellent addition to the game, very interesting with beautiful graphics and also the fact that the "luck" factor that dominates the museum and the council is missing makes it a very "honorable" idea.

what disappoints me somehow is the following:

I expected that this new addition would open up new avenues in the game, namely that more troop combos would be more efficient and there would be more diversity.

unfortunately, it turns out that exactly the opposite happened
before the manufactory helicopters, mortar/siege and fighters/bombers were the three dominant combos.

moreover, even the helicopters have become very weak, in front of all these protected/antibetrayed tanks that are really too strong.

especially in bases from perk23 alliances, the number of defending tanks is unreal.

Of course, this has something to do with the fact that now the defender spawn time has dropped to very low times with so many bonuses that a defender can collect.

an average defense base has about 40-50% dst from the council alone.

additional -5sec from the munitions

additional dst from directives, perks, acropolis, etc.
and finally the museum.

now only mortars can be countered against all these defenders!

Of course there are also helicopter attacks that bring good results but to do this you need premium TTs, recons and extra buildings. because without these very simply, they get stuck and die in front of the defending tanks.

but what about all the other troops in the game?
they simply have no hope for serious defensive bases.

i played for almost two years with mortar /siege / apc with good results. but I'm really bored with them for so long and I'm looking to find a different combo that can be somehow effective and fun. Suddenly can't.

Some ideas that could help the game to have more diversity:

1: drones! defensive drone is an excellent tool for defense but on the other hand the offensive is unacceptable.

most players just throw it into the base to activate any gci! let's make it more useful...

2: troop, air troop and war tactics capacity

we have the same air capacity since Atomic age! I think I don't need to say anything else..

we also have the same war tactic & troop capacity from the digital age.

I think this should be fixed.

The bases have grown quite a bit after all these years, but the army you can bring into battle has remained the same for a long time.

3:Τhe manufactory greatly strengthened almost every aspect of the defense of the bases (e.g. for the bunkers you can assign the emergency alert system, rapid deployment radio and additionally HTE rounds and communication relay on the HTs that spawn from them! maybe its too much ??) the same of course applies to the tank depots, garrison and rocket arsenal.

additional +1 range on all firing buildings.

after all this, wouldn't it be a good idea to have munitions for the generals as well so that they can "hold" more in the battles as silo bait but also become a little more useful?

4: also something else:
the fact that two war tactics were rendered useless (sabotage and betrayal are almost useless in auto age since you basically cannot use them) is something that should probably be corrected.

for example, instead of being canceled by the defensive drone, the sabotage could be set to have a reduced duration and affect only one building, not a "group" of buildings.

on the other hand, betrayal instead of not being able to be applied at all for a while, could be applied but the betrayed troop has -50% dmg & hp in relation to normal.

5:
One last thing.

Heavy tanks, bazookas, machine guns, MRLs and attack helicopters I believe urgently need reinforcement against defending tanks. they just have no luck with the current data.

Are ok against buildings but really weak and useless against defending tanks. *
(the machine gun troops need a total rework I think)

@Harlems369th

Bro why crying about defense , there are tons of videoa on YouTube of guys of drone and info age taking down auto age with helicopters and mortar strategy
Just because you are not creative enough to deal with little better defense doens't mean game is biased.
Helicopter or mortar have also +1 range y u didn't mentioned it
Artillery literally out ranges everything except sniper tower nd mortar which obviously aren't a threat to it. You guys just want an easy strategy...

 

[DocHolliday]

Bro why crying about defense , there are tons of videoa on YouTube of guys of drone and info age taking down auto age with helicopters and mortar strategy
Just because you are not creative enough to deal with little better defense doens't mean game is biased.
Helicopter or mortar have also +1 range y u didn't mentioned it
Artillery literally out ranges everything except sniper tower nd mortar which obviously aren't a threat to it. You guys just want an easy strategy...

if you read carefully what I wrote, you would understand that we are saying exactly the same thing!

I didn't say that mortars / artillery are not efficient in battles, on the contrary, it is almost the only ground combo that can deal with defending tanks at the moment.

and that I thought that the manufactory would change this, but it hasn't so far.

all other ground troops are very weak (HT, zooks, MGs, MBTs, assault vehicles etc)

I have no objection to strengthening the defense and making the wars more competitive.

however, I don't like how 80% of the game's troops are sidelined as useless and ineffective while the same troop combos continue to dominate, before and after the manufactory.

p.s and no, mortars do not have +1 range from munitions

 

[King Crimson]

Well said mate. Its exactly the combo im trying in the recent weeks!
but again, it's a combo that has to do with helicopters. as before.

the only thing I hoped for was that the manufactory would bring new viable options, which it has not brought so far.

HTs, RPGs, MGs, MRLs, assault vehicles, MBTs, Tactical helicopters, etc., remained in obscurity again..

Personally, l have fewer helis and 4 zooks with 2 mortars. I find these compliment/protect the helis nicely. For me it's about the balance.

 

[Seek]

How many air slots does one need to take down a auto age base ? Really more air slots are not needed consider my base kills all ground troops then I get watch for about 1:30 bomber tactics and fighters kill the base in about 3 min. All you need is great fighter muse with fortified strong hold and hanger to kill any and all bases. Great job BHG with zero balance on defeating fighter muses

If anything up AA on bases and remove the fortified strong and hanger extra slots from the game. If you want more air slots . Really the 30 buck I won stronghold needs gone.

 

[DocHolliday]

How many air slots does one need to take down a auto age base ? Really more air slots are not needed consider my base kills all ground troops then I get watch for about 1:30 bomber tactics and fighters kill the base in about 3 min. All you need is great fighter muse with fortified strong hold and hanger to kill any and all bases. Great job BHG with zero balance on defeating fighter muses

If anything up AA on bases and remove the fortified strong and hanger extra slots from the game. If you want more air slots . Really the 30 buck I won stronghold needs gone.

Yeah that's ridiculous.
10 air space from nighthawk hangar plus 5 TTs from FS is OP. Clearly.

But in this thread, basically i'm talking about those weak ground troops that I wrote above, which urgently need help,for example a boost against those defending tanks , not to become the new meta game, but simply to be able to stand decently on the battlefield.

I was hoping that with the manufactory they would get what they needed to be a viable alternative option, but unfortunately they have sunk even further into obscurity.

*Btw, i think the only reason for every imbalance in plane/bomber attacks its just the recon TTs . Not the museum/air capacity.

The recon TT is that which causes every imbalance over defense.

 

[Seek]

Yeah that's ridiculous.
10 air space from nighthawk hangar plus 5 TTs from FS is OP. Clearly.

But in this thread, basically i'm talking about those weak ground troops that I wrote above, which urgently need help,for example a boost against those defending tanks , not to become the new meta game, but simply to be able to stand decently on the battlefield.

I was hoping that with the manufactory they would get what they needed to be a viable alternative option, but unfortunately they have sunk even further into obscurity.

*Btw, i think the only reason for every imbalance in plane/bomber attacks its just the recon TTs . Not the museum/air capacity.

The recon TT is that which causes every imbalance over defense.

Well recon hurts I agree but with new Munitions plenty of fighter artifacts and hell they just added another.
As for your arguments about boost need for ground troops I would agree with some boost for all factory troops starting at 10% boost dps and hp. If you boost them keep in mind defender troops get boosted as well.
Now for argument sabotage is dead I disagree, I seen several players use it successfully just have to wait out the drone that blocks it.
Betrayal still works again just to have wait which is something i totally agree with.

So in end i agree with boosting some ground mainly factory only if they reduce the power of air troops and FSH being removed lol
But if air power is not reduced then nothing should be added to ground got to give defenders some chance

Is boring watching fighters killing bases after their ground died at 1:30 and then ya get to watch base slowly die at 3:10

Ps BHG if you want to make money start charging 100 bucks for the FSH lol

 

[TitanKnight]

How is defense going to handle more variety of attacks? Maybe let defense able equip 4 coalitions?
Egyptian, Maori, Russian, Filipinos.
Bombers might become popular soon Plane Gyros available for 300 tokens.

 

[DocHolliday]

How is defense going to handle more variety of attacks? Maybe let defense able equip 4 coalitions?
Egyptian, Maori, Russian, Filipinos.
Bombers might become popular soon Plane Gyros available for 300 tokens.

Interesting idea the additional coalition! Always we were able to assign 3 coalitions, probably its time for another one

 

[Seek]

It would be more fair allow Defenders to run 4 coal. Since everybody buys the FSH.
But what will happen is this all the Strikers will go off deep end about how hard bases are to kill cause they can only 5 star 7 out of 10 bases and most hit taking 3 min or more.

I get it’s an attacking game but when you have fighters running +200%DPS and HP+150% with FSH or Bombers running close to same. What chances do D players have . Above numbers are with muse council not even counting coals lol

BTW when FSH became common is when crazy numbers showed in replays

 

[King Crimson]

How many air slots does one need to take down a auto age base ? Really more air slots are not needed consider my base kills all ground troops then I get watch for about 1:30 bomber tactics and fighters kill the base in about 3 min. All you need is great fighter muse with fortified strong hold and hanger to kill any and all bases. Great job BHG with zero balance on defeating fighter muses

If anything up AA on bases and remove the fortified strong and hanger extra slots from the game. If you want more air slots . Really the 30 buck I won stronghold needs gone.

Clearly these players have no idea how to attack so BHG threw them a bone by making bombers the easy way to win.
I don't mind watching 90secs of bomber wave after wave - hopefully it gives the player time to reflect just how sad their attack was.

 

[Seek]

Clearly these players have no idea how to attack so BHG threw them a bone by making bombers the easy way to win.
I don't mind watching 90secs of bomber wave after wave - hopefully it gives the player time to reflect just how sad their attack was.

It’s simple most folks are afraid to give defenders even the slightest fair fight lol Everyone is obsessed that every bases has to be 5 star hit well I prefer real competition where every ️ counts not hey I bought a FSH and Hangar so I win you suck defenders lol even though BHG sold them the win lol

Wanna prove your best attacker do it in a fair or even somewhat fair fight lol oh thats right you can’t lol Except for my boy LEO

 

[King Crimson]

Yeah that's ridiculous.
10 air space from nighthawk hangar plus 5 TTs from FS is OP. Clearly.

But in this thread, basically i'm talking about those weak ground troops that I wrote above, which urgently need help,for example a boost against those defending tanks , not to become the new meta game, but simply to be able to stand decently on the battlefield.

Some players are like: How many bombers does it take to destroy a base? Not enough!

Anyway, I remember a suggestion many years ago, along the lines of why not limit the number of any one type of troop. ie: no more than 4 zooks or helis or mortars or artillery or HTs, etc, etc. Needless to say the community wasn't happy and probably for good reason. It doesn't make sense giving us free will to design our own army combo then take away the most basic freedom - but I think the idea has merit especially when 2 or 3 troops become disproportionately effective. This would help to balance an army by using some of the rarely used troops.

Of course, that would make a lot more sense if these 'other' troops were actually more effective than they currently are. Having said that, I've seen Roman armies use massed infantry to good effect. I've recently seen Brits & Koreans use shooters to good effect. These 'other' troops can still be effective but like any troop combo they might take time and finesse to perfect the strategy.

So while I agree that 'other' troops may be neglected I don't think the manufactory not helping is the issue - the starting point of some troops are just further behind than others. And naturally the average player just wants to use the troops that are further ahead in the game.

Incidentally, I've started seeing a change in the 'flow' of my attacks. I'm starting to think that it's only now the manufactory is having an effect - now that 3, 4, 5 troop types are finally benefitting from maxed munitions. So while it might be 6mths already, I'm thinking maybe after another 6mths of experimenting you might have a different view .....

 

[DocHolliday]

Some players are like: How many bombers does it take to destroy a base? Not enough!

Anyway, I remember a suggestion many years ago, along the lines of why not limit the number of any one type of troop. ie: no more than 4 zooks or helis or mortars or artillery or HTs, etc, etc. Needless to say the community wasn't happy and probably for good reason. It doesn't make sense giving us free will to design our own army combo then take away the most basic freedom - but I think the idea has merit especially when 2 or 3 troops become disproportionately effective. This would help to balance an army by using some of the rarely used troops.

Of course, that would make a lot more sense if these 'other' troops were actually more effective than they currently are. Having said that, I've seen Roman armies use massed infantry to good effect. I've recently seen Brits & Koreans use shooters to good effect. These 'other' troops can still be effective but like any troop combo they might take time and finesse to perfect the strategy.

So while I agree that 'other' troops may be neglected I don't think the manufactory not helping is the issue - the starting point of some troops are just further behind than others. And naturally the average player just wants to use the troops that are further ahead in the game.

Incidentally, I've started seeing a change in the 'flow' of my attacks. I'm starting to think that it's only now the manufactory is having an effect - now that 3, 4, 5 troop types are finally benefitting from maxed munitions. So while it might be 6mths already, I'm thinking maybe after another 6mths of experimenting you might have a different view .....

Good point. We'll see, maybe in the future different combos will become viable... Hopefully..

 

[oddin]

I agree that offence needs a buff in certain -very specific- areas .

Defence is very very ok now and the vast majority of wars end up in stars and not time. This is good! But rendering betrayal and sabotage useless is not ok. Playing only with fighters and LEGO is also not ok. More troop combos should be viable.