Mythical ASDIC Type 113X: EPIC FAIL

[Harlems369th]

This logic is flawed. You’re trying to differentiate between the poll your company put out for rebalance and mythical artifacts as if one doesn’t directly correlate to the other. It most certainly does.

It’s like rebalancing a fighting game by adjusting character stats, then adding new weapons and saying the weapons don’t affect the balance. Even if they came from a different update, players still use both in the same matches, so they impact each other and should be taken into consideration.

This we agree, you're saying a longer version of what I said. The combat rebalance plans, however, are separate changes/releases and Mythicals, while yes, are adding another aspect to the game that requires overall balance are not an objective of a rebalance as they are new entities to the game.

In regards to the community’s impression on the 2 Mythical Artifacts that have been revealed, what did you expect? You quite literally have everyone on all of your socials (not just end game) complaining about the same thing, expressing that defenders are getting destroyed by bombers.

Your flagship attacker and defender Mythical Artifact reveals for what is considered a major update to the game consist of an insanely strong bomber Mythical, followed by a defender Mythical that grants an extra line for something defenders typically consider least important (generals). Since these are your flagship pieces meant to hype up players about the update, both should be truly impressive.

I fully understand that there is more to come but let’s be realistic, you’re own team won’t know what the end result is going to be after all mythicals, showcase, and rebalancing is completed until it’s put into play and data is collected. Why keep digging yourselves into a deeper hole instead of listening to players?

I have a suggestion that would help everyone. Do monthly in game surveys like other games have. Add an announcement in game that directs players to DomiWorld and allows them to vote once per month on their state of the game with basic questions rating troops on a scale of 1-5 or something like that. The data collected could be completely automated with a simple monthly report broken down to what different ages feel are overpowered and underpowered. Simple list like this:

Fighters 1 2 3 4 5
Bombers 1 2 3 4 5
Transports 1 2 3 4 5
Recon 1 2 3 4 5
Barrack troops 1 2 3 4 5
Factory troops 1 2 3 4 5
Generals 1 2 3 4 5
Defenders 1 2 3 4 5
Air traps 1 2 3 4 5
Ground traps 1 2 3 4 5

I know you were gone for a while, but we did monthly surveys for quite some time. The survey results you shared were from November of last year, but we continued to run surveys well into March of this year. I completely understand it's hard to see/know what to expect from changes when they're drip-fed to everyone like this. It's especially frustrating when considering the difficulty of adjusting your heavily invested museums.

I'm still asking that we give a full runway for the changes we're planning for combat rebalance in 2025 and make it easier for players to pivot museums and research, and not just remove strategies you've worked so hard to develop.

 

[KrispyCrame]

I'm still asking that we give a full runway for the changes we're planning for combat rebalance in 2025 and make it easier for players to pivot museums and make it easier for players to pivot museums and research, and not just remove strategies you've worked so hard to develop.

The problem with this is that the rebalance is tiered and creating unwanted and lengthy distortions. Demolition is taking out multiple D buildings allowing bombers to have a field day. Even if you adjust your base, the demolition is OP and cannot be defended against. We are left waiting for notes on the next steps of the rebalance curious if this game will even survive. A rebalance should not be tiered, especially when future plans are not disclosed, and while a game altering mechanic will be introduced at the same time. Even if you yell from the rooftops the new features are not part of the rebalancing, can you or other developers speak on how Mythicals and showcases would impact the changes of the rebalance and the game in totality? I'm not sold it was considered.


Moreover, you caught my interest about pivoting museums. Pivoting museums sucks but council is even worse. It's an endless casino and with more councilors being released it's virtually impossible to secure a legendary card of interest without sinking massive resources. Will this be reworked or considered?

 

[Nikolay]

There's one more sentence here that you're missing.

Mythicals, while adding another layer of strategy, are not a part of the Combat Rebalance.

Are you serious?
If you want to achieve a balance of troops in the game, then everything that affects them should be balanced, including artifacts.

It is extremely hypocritical to talk about balance over and over again, but at the same time create an imbalance

 

[Nikolay]

How long do we as defense players have to wait for the update when the Mongol coalition and bombers are balanced taking into account the first two steps - 12.18 and 12.19?

 

[Harlems369th]

The problem with this is that the rebalance is tiered and creating unwanted and lengthy distortions. Demolition is taking out multiple D buildings allowing bombers to have a field day. Even if you adjust your base, the demolition is OP and cannot be defended against. We are left waiting for notes on the next steps of the rebalance curious if this game will even survive. A rebalance should not be tiered, especially when future plans are not disclosed, and while a game altering mechanic will be introduced at the same time. Even if you yell from the rooftops the new features are not part of the rebalancing, can you or other developers speak on how Mythicals and showcases would impact the changes of the rebalance and the game in totality? I'm not sold it was considered.


Moreover, you caught my interest about pivoting museums. Pivoting museums sucks but council is even worse. It's an endless casino and with more councilors being released it's virtually impossible to secure a legendary card of interest without sinking massive resources. Will this be reworked or considered?

The overall balance is being considered, yes, on all fronts. I'm sorry if I didn't make that clear or muddled the message further. Of course, Mythicals and the Combat Rebalance Initiative are all part of the overall balance of the game. When I say Mythicals are not directly related to combat rebalance I mean to reframe that units/tactics/buildings/etc. being adjusted directly that is what we call our Combat Rebalance Initiative, and the adjustments are being made with consideration of all surrounding aspects (museum, council, etc.).

The trickle adjustments is to ensure that each step of changes creates the intended design behavior. The team doesn't want to make sweeping changes off rip, there are considerations and arguments for both paths (the micro adjustments we're doing now, and one massive update) but this is the path the team has decided for now. I'm advocating for everyone to be able to see what that step by step update looks like so you're not left in limbo. We're still actively discussing it.

The feedback is valued, but there are definitely things that we see behind the scenes that aren't always apparent from what you see in play. Some adjustments might not make sense immediately, but they're further treatments of a 'disease' (do not take this literally) rather than a symptom. We're looking holistically at the game, that means all ages, how you're playing, what you're saying, and data we see from your battles. Mythicals and showcase is 1000% a MASSIVE change to the game, and creates cause to resurface previously proposed changes (-85% cap for example) and fix lingering issues around the museum experience. And that is just the Museum, Council of course is another aspect, and just because I don't say anything about it doesn't mean it isn't being considered.

 

[goldeneagle]

I THINK WITH MYTHICAL ASDIC INVADING TROOPS REACHED MAX CAP

MYTHICAL
ASDIC
			142	ADTD
			167	ADTH
24			198	DST
			13	ADTD+H
			16	D D
			49	D HP
24			43	I BARR D
			40	I MOR D	83
			39	I MOR HP
			27	I RS HP
			59	IFI D	83
			27	I FT H
			57	I BOM D	81
			91	I BOM H	91
24			24	INV AS TR DMG
24			24	INV FA TR DMG
			17	GEN D
			43	GEN H
			52	GEN D+H
			0	INV GEN D
24			24	INV GEN H
			0	INV GEN D+H

 

[King Crimson]

There's one more sentence here that you're missing.

As usual, you're missing the point.
Read the room.

 

[Seek]

As usual, you're missing the point.
Read the room.

Yes read the room the game is unplayable for defenders. Then you offer ASDIC while offense get Spitfire more bomber crap no defender can stop.

I know this is pushing players like myself to tipping point. This roll out of Mythical and Rebalancing has been a total failure that anyone that actually plays the game saw coming.

The new defense mythical needs changed to something better period

demolition needs nerfed now not later
bombers need nerfed now not later

Remember madd players don’t spend especially when you totally took defense out of the game. It is completely unnecessary the timing of demo change has completely ruined the game for defenders like myself

 

[LuSt]

This we agree, you're saying a longer version of what I said. The combat rebalance plans, however, are separate changes/releases and Mythicals, while yes, are adding another aspect to the game that requires overall balance are not an objective of a rebalance as they are new entities to the game.


I know you were gone for a while, but we did monthly surveys for quite some time. The survey results you shared were from November of last year, but we continued to run surveys well into March of this year. I completely understand it's hard to see/know what to expect from changes when they're drip-fed to everyone like this. It's especially frustrating when considering the difficulty of adjusting your heavily invested museums.

I'm still asking that we give a full runway for the changes we're planning for combat rebalance in 2025 and make it easier for players to pivot museums and research, and not just remove strategies you've worked so hard to develop.

Sorry for the late response, been working insane overtime so I can afford mythical artifacts (seriously though, back to back doubles are a killer)

I’m not trying to argue, and I understand that as a company, decisions are made through group consensus and with a broader plan in mind. Some of that process is shared with the community, while other parts understandably remain internal.

I’ve acknowledged that we’re in a transitional phase of the game until Mythicals are fully released, and unfortunately, defenders are feeling the impact most. The community, especially defenders, needs some sign that things will eventually reach a balanced state. The Asdic, as the first defender Mythical, just doesn’t inspire that confidence. That’s the core of my concern.

I love the concept of Showcase, Mythicals help make it viable, but only if Mythicals are truly mythical. The Asdic is not. It doesn’t build trust in the idea that balance is coming. If anything, it raises concerns about the data guiding these decisions. I’d genuinely like to understand what ages thought generals were a core issue for defenders. They’ve been weak across all ages, ever since Manufacturing was introduced, which offered no boosts for generals while vastly empowering every other troop type.

That leads to my next question: where were the surveys conducted? Was there an in-game link for all players? Were rewards offered that might have skewed the data, with players clicking through without thought? Was “generals” listed as the first option, potentially inflating its results due to basic survey psychology?

I truly believe that if a new survey were created, like the example I gave above, that was accessible in-game, without rewards, and framed clearly as a tool to help improve the game that the results would look very different. I strongly encourage the team to consider that. Also, sharing the results by age, not just an overall number, would give more clarity to the community.

I know this may seem slightly off topic, but the survey results and Mythical stats are closely connected, they both play a critical role in building trust that the Showcase and Mythicals will actually make the game more interesting and balanced.

 

[Seek]

How about doing the survey of veteran players and newer players separately because End Game Players are the ones that are deeply invested in the game and its success. Where as the newer player have little invested and most have less knowledge of the game.

Then if you do separate polls you can cater to both groups and make game balanced for all. What may be a big issue for a level 180 is different for than what is a big issue for level 400+..

 

[maggiepie]

In terms of the survey, I believe it was announced via an in-game mailbox link, likely to a jotform, with no rewards for completion. Jotform has the capability to randomize item response order; and statistics can be applied to analyze order effect bias, if one were so inclined. If PID was attached to each completed survey, they could theoretically gather additional data on respondents - such as how long players have been playing, what ages their accounts are in, activity levels, spending habits, any details they collect on an account at all really (so separate polls are not required- this data could already be cross-referenced and analyzed for differences or even controlled for as a confound.)

I think the additional survey suggestions are super interesting and get even deeper into the analysis!

 

[KrispyCrame]

The overall balance is being considered, yes, on all fronts. I'm sorry if I didn't make that clear or muddled the message further. Of course, Mythicals and the Combat Rebalance Initiative are all part of the overall balance of the game. When I say Mythicals are not directly related to combat rebalance I mean to reframe that units/tactics/buildings/etc. being adjusted directly that is what we call our Combat Rebalance Initiative, and the adjustments are being made with consideration of all surrounding aspects (museum, council, etc.).

The trickle adjustments is to ensure that each step of changes creates the intended design behavior. The team doesn't want to make sweeping changes off rip, there are considerations and arguments for both paths (the micro adjustments we're doing now, and one massive update) but this is the path the team has decided for now. I'm advocating for everyone to be able to see what that step by step update looks like so you're not left in limbo. We're still actively discussing it.

The feedback is valued, but there are definitely things that we see behind the scenes that aren't always apparent from what you see in play. Some adjustments might not make sense immediately, but they're further treatments of a 'disease' (do not take this literally) rather than a symptom. We're looking holistically at the game, that means all ages, how you're playing, what you're saying, and data we see from your battles. Mythicals and showcase is 1000% a MASSIVE change to the game, and creates cause to resurface previously proposed changes (-85% cap for example) and fix lingering issues around the museum experience. And that is just the Museum, Council of course is another aspect, and just because I don't say anything about it doesn't mean it isn't being considered.

This is great, thanks for responding Harlems. I had a fear that two separate teams were working on rebalance and new features and not doing a lot of communication..