Manufactory: Will defense become too OP?

[Rollin]

1.Of course "protected spawned units" are definitely OP defensive buff and very easy to access. ( I have it already activate it on all my spawning buildings and i am Offensive player) .
*Combined with alliance perk 23 , that making bunkers spawn 2(!) HTs at the First wave and with that munition that making spawning troops immune to betrayal and all those huge amounts of DST from defensive councilors is clearly OP.

2. Those munitions providing additional reduction on defender spawn time as well.
( But there is none offensive munitions that provides enemy defender spawn time to counter that.)

3. L.R.E optics, is another great one defensive munition that would provide +1 range to every shooting building. (Along with the rest defensive bonuses that provides)
No offensive munitions to counter that so far.
Hopefully they'll add new munitions soon to bring balance.


On the other hand, manufactory is a GREAT addition for the game, wonderful graphics, well organised and very interesting stuff to explore with.

1. The guilds first have to reach level 23, which is extremely difficult and takes ALOT time. How much Betraya do you play with? 30? Be serious, you play with 1-3 Betraya not more.

I think it's stupid to use the Betraya ammunition for 1-3 Betrayer tactics, its useless and stupid.

2. „Spawn Time“ do you know how much that is? NOTHING 3-4% DST… what do you want with that ?

3. If the Deff didn't get a +1 range, the Deff would be so weak that you wouldn't have had to play Deff. Artillery now +8 Range, Helis +6, MRL +6 and much more…

 

[witCat]

Currently the Off will be much stronger than the Deff.

Let's do the math.

Mortar:
33% HP
42% Sps
6% Attakspeed
5% Movementspeed
-5% Overall Dmg reducing
-13% Dmg Reducing when moving.

Artillery:
22% HP
30% sps
+1 range
9% movement speed
-5% overall dmg
11% attack speed

The Deff will have
51% HP
14% Sps
+1 Range
6% Speed
-15% Dmg Reduction vs Ground
-5% Overall Dmg Reduction

Conclusion: The mortars/artillery will receive significantly less damage (14% All Tower SPS vs. 22%/33% TP and -5%/-11% Damage reduction) and will live longer. The damage dealt will remain about the same without recon or will lean more towards the artillery/mortar side (51% HP vs. 30%/42% SPS). With recons, it will be extremely unbalanced as everything multiplies by x3.

Yes, the mortars will have one less range, but the artillery will have one more. Through small Buffs you can strengthen the mortar with more HP, Proctetion ore Heal.

The defenders will in turn become stronger due to the protection, this will make the mortars slower, the easy solution will be a lot of EDST, which is easily possible as a mortar player.

The Deff always has to be able to adapt, but can't have everything. Either high DST values or high HP/SPS All Towers, both are almost impossible.

I think mortars will have to have an adapted way of playing, then I think it will be stronger than before. Fighters become weaker. I think helicopters will remain strong.

From the numbers I don't see any "overpower Deff" unless someone can explain to me exactly what the Deff is overpowering?

Thanks Rollin, good to have different perspectives and opinions without becoming defensive and berating others. However, the solution of an attacker going with high EDST is not that easy as it can only be obtained from museum. BHG has given defenders many ways to increase this stat through Acropolis, library, council etc. So high EDST can easily be countered.

 

[witCat]

Lets look at this scenario:
1. Alliance perk 23 - Adds +1 defender in first wave so 3 tanks and 2 HT’s. (With protect)
2. Rapid deployment - Adds +2 troops to all spawn buildings
3. Emergency Alert - +10s No betrayal.
In total 5 tanks and 4 HT’s with protect cant be betrayed as well as an extra -5s spawn speed with munitions 2 & 3 assIgned.

Thats a hell of a lot of spawning troops to deal with.

Thats why I asked if ETB participants were given an opportunity to test offence against defense like they would in a war scenario with coalitions, and full museums. Until now @Harlems369th and @TheWise didn't answer my question. I have a suspicion that this was not the case and we as players have to speculate if the game will be OP for defenders or attackers or will it be balanced.

 

[Seek]

It’s not the players job to test all this crybaby offense players or defense players want It BHG job to test the crab so stop with a the lest do the math crap or it bullshit post crap.

Facts are this BHG made mistakes on all sides of this roll out. From the offensive side they made Defense too strong cause I can’t roll bases in under 1 min 30 from the Defensive they didn’t do enough. From old account havin their accounts devalued . From cheater haters not fixing battle reports.

So how about we stop attacking each others post ? This why they don’t respond why would they there are enough trolls sucking up to BHG to put down legitimate complaints and troll hating on BHG get squashed by thread being buried by the trolls in BHG side lol which more than likely are BHG employee acting as players lol

So everybody here is idea instead buying the next item on game buy a six pack or some weed and chill it supposed to be a fun game .

 

[Chartlux]

In the replay, the Mortar Infantry, benefiting from War Artifacts and coalitions of Mongols and Aztecs, easily destroyed my Heavy Cavalry Defenders and Heavy Tank Defenders. Maori Coalitions and 'Troops gain "Protect" when spawned' did not have much impact.

 

[Rollin]

Thanks Rollin, good to have different perspectives and opinions without becoming defensive and berating others. However, the solution of an attacker going with high EDST is not that easy as it can only be obtained from museum. BHG has given defenders many ways to increase this stat through Acropolis, library, council etc. So high EDST can easily be countered.

Yeahh

It sounds like a lot but it isn't.

Council that you need as Deff: Baudica, Churchil, Myiammoto, Yi Sun-sin, Guan, Queen and until 18.12 Cleo then switch. You see, you don't really have the opportunity to make a big change at the Council. Its still 28-30% DST

DST and EDST are 1:1 the same with full Legendary Council members I have listed in Legendäry.

how much will a strong DST deff have 150% ? A guild member gets 190% or more EDST with his mortar museum and this is huge… 44sek spawn time for the 150% DST Defender player. And in the past Mortar dont use alot EDST because they didn't need it

The Deff cannot go completely to DST because the Figthers are currently even stronger than the mortars. As you can see, the Deff doesn't have the opportunity to cover everything

The Maori coalition hardly had any added value for a very long time because the mortars simply dismantled every defender in seconds. The protection gives a good push to the defenders so that they are more “usable”.

 

[Maxis]

I have a feeling that if RDR protect was level 10, we weren't so pissed. It is so OP that me and all the attackers I know have already put it on their 4 spawning buildings. so far they have reached level 3 or 4 of the attacker munitions.
On another note, +2 spawn is applied on the max number of spawned troops which is pretty useless for defense but very good for APCs!

 

[DocHolliday]

1. The guilds first have to reach level 23, which is extremely difficult and takes ALOT time. How much Betraya do you play with? 30? Be serious, you play with 1-3 Betraya not more.

I think it's stupid to use the Betraya ammunition for 1-3 Betrayer tactics, its useless and stupid.

2. „Spawn Time“ do you know how much that is? NOTHING 3-4% DST… what do you want with that ?

3. If the Deff didn't get a +1 range, the Deff would be so weak that you wouldn't have had to play Deff. Artillery now +8 Range, Helis +6, MRL +6 and much more…

1: My alliance will reach perk 23 in 2-3 wars.

2 : a helicopter attacker usually taking 4-6 betrayals on enemy HTs. Because defending HTs delay AHs very much and also kill them in 2 hits .

3: is not 3-4% dst but 3-4 seconds dst.
Also there is nowhere EDST on munitions for attackers.
Also, we all know, a full purple council (not orange)right now providing at least -50% dst for defenders.( And im not including all those all defensive tower dmg& hp lines in defensive councilors , which exists only for defenders. Not aedtd/hp lines for attackers again.
And again, no one councilor provides EDST for attackers.

4:About range, AHs will gain +1 , defenses +1 so nothing will change.
BUT as you mentioned, only those 3 units will gain +1 so far. So the other units will suffer.

 

[DocHolliday]

Did you even try to betrayal troops with protection before you write bullshits like this?
Of course,you didn't.

Of course. I did .
Why my comment considered as bullshits?

 

[Rollin]

1: My alliance will reach perk 23 in 2-3 wars.

2 : a helicopter attacker usually taking 4-6 betrayals on enemy HTs. Because defending HTs delay AHs very mach also kill them in 2 hits .

3: is not 3-4% dst but 3-4 seconds dst.
Also there is nowhere EDST on munitions for attackers.
Also, we all know, a full purple council (not orange)right now providing at least -50% dst for defenders.( And im not including all those all defensive tower dmg& hp lines in defensive councilors , which exists only for defenders. Not aedtd/hp lines for attackers again.
And again, no one councilor provides EDST for attackers.

4:About range, AHs will gain +1 , defenses +1 so nothing will change.
BUT as you mentioned, only those 3 units will gain +1 so far. So the other units will suffer.

1. 1 in 1000 maybe

2. It's new to me that Heli tactics with 4-6 betraya plays instead of protection

3. how much are 3-4 seconds in DST? Apparently you know it

Full Purple give -50% DST ? are we playing another Dominations?

You ignore that the Council gives Heli and Mortar/Artillery and Transporters alot of HP/Dmg

4. So the other units will suffer ? what other Units/Tactics do you want to play? It was not possible before the manufractur ? Now you can Play maybe MRLs

I won't respond anymore, it appears you have limited knowledge of the game.

 

[Sigfried von Xanten]

Hilarious! Some complaining that defense is getting protect for some units. Are you serious? Attackers have been using protect for years And still do. Those defense units which will get protect for 20 secs are on the ground. They can’t fly. In the mean time, attackers have been using Transports to fly over defense bases, deploy paratroopers and putting protects on them basically making them almost invincible while wiping out the middle of a base. Some attackers can wipeout 2/3 of a base with paratroopers alone. Oh, let’s not forget the OP Mortars. Attackers can upgrade them in the museum and the committee both. Defenders have zero invading Mortar troop defense in the committee. ZERO!
Wait a minute, let’s not forget the helicopters, Fighters and the many war Legendary’s attackers have gotten the last 2-3 years. Defense only got 2 new war Legendary’s during that time.
No, defense is not OP. No where near OP. A case can be made that offense is and has been OP. Yea yea yea, go ahead and attack me. I’m out numbered because there are many more attackers than defenders. I could care less.
Keep it up complaining with empty BS. Soon you will lose more defenders and enjoy attacking crappy defense bases.

And, don’t forget to cry that Dominations is an attacking game. Who ever came up with that one should have their head examind. It’s a War game and needs to be challenging, strategic and fun. You want easy street go to another game.

Horsepower. I could not agree more. The game is challenging and evolving. Players need to adjust to stay ahead. This means more development work and requires more thinking, but it is what makes the game so enticing.

 

[DocHolliday]

1. 1 in 1000 maybe

2. It's new to me that Heli tactics with 4-6 betraya plays instead of protection

3. how much are 3-4 seconds in DST? Apparently you know it

Full Purple give -50% DST ? are we playing another Dominations?

You ignore that the Council gives Heli and Mortar/Artillery and Transporters alot of HP/Dmg

4. So the other units will suffer ? what other Units/Tactics do you want to play? It was not possible before the manufractur ? Now you can Play maybe MRLs

I won't respond anymore, it appears you have limited knowledge of the game.

About council dst:
Red cloud, guan yu and queen provides up to 30% dst plus Boudicca committee -20 dst near wonders, is about 50% , isn't??

Of course council giving to AHs/mortars/artillery dmg and hp but there is not EDST or aedtd/hp for attackers as exists DST/ adtd/hp for defenders.

About troops who will suffer:

I think many players had wondering that manufactory will bring more diversity to viable troop compositions (commandos or factory troops for example)
But suddenly, with those defensive munitions we'll have the same meta game again.

Mortars, AHs, fighters.

 

[Rollin]

About council dst:
Red cloud, guan yu and queen provides up to 30% dst plus Boudicca committee -20 dst near wonders, is about 50% , isn't??

Of course council giving to AHs/mortars/artillery dmg and hp but there is not EDST or aedtd/hp for attackers as exists DST/ adtd/hp for defenders.

About troops who will suffer:

I think many players had wondering that manufactory will bring more diversity to viable troop compositions (commandos or factory troops for example)
But suddenly, with those defensive munitions we'll have the same meta game again.

Mortars, AHs, fighters.

You dont play with Guan/Red and Queen at the same time ? U lose too mutch better stats

20% DST is near Wonder not Overall, then you need Library, Univerity, 2 Legendary Council (Red,Guan,Queen) and everythink that can DST push… for a 1:1 DST:EDST

again the off can get significantly higher EDST then Def DST. I see alot of Mortar player with 170-190% EDST. The Deff lose too mutch other stats if they go the same 170-190% DST.

You see ? The Off dont need more EDST Pushing

You can but then you have 70-90% Dmg/HP All Towers. Then Fighters will easily destroy you

You need a perfect Deff Museum for this scenario… But no one has, at least I've never seen it.

You dont need destroy every defense? if a Def has 170% DST then a Figther will destroy him, if someone has low DST then a Mortar will destroy him. The Deff can't cover everything

Its a Multiplayer game.

you forgot MRL and Bomber which have become significantly stronger

 

[King Crimson]

It’s not the players job to test all this crybaby offense players or defense players want It BHG job to test the crab so stop with a the lest do the math crap or it bullshit post crap.

Facts are this BHG made mistakes on all sides of this roll out. From the offensive side they made Defense too strong cause I can’t roll bases in under 1 min 30 from the Defensive they didn’t do enough. From old account havin their accounts devalued . From cheater haters not fixing battle reports.

So how about we stop attacking each others post ? This why they don’t respond why would they there are enough trolls sucking up to BHG to put down legitimate complaints and troll hating on BHG get squashed by thread being buried by the trolls in BHG side lol which more than likely are BHG employee acting as players lol

So everybody here is idea instead buying the next item on game buy a six pack or some weed and chill it supposed to be a fun game .

You crack me up! You say 'how about we stop attacking each other' then you tell people to stop their bullshit posts?? And I see you're still on about your devalued base. Maybe you should take some of your own advice and chill out.

It's always the same when a new challenge comes along: people look at the numbers and form opinions. There are many other things that affect an overall attack - the least of which is what buffs the enemy has implemented. We can bitch and moan all we want about how an attack might go but until we have some solid attacks in a few weeks/months, it's all opinions.
And until we get that in-game data, many of us appreciate the people who take the time to bring us this 'math crap'.

The biggest problem with additions to the game is not the challenge or the new metas or crafting different buffs, it's that some people don't want to change or try something new. It's all just too hard to have to re-think ...

 

[Seek]

You crack me up! You say 'how about we stop attacking each other' then you tell people to stop their bullshit posts?? And I see you're still on about your devalued base. Maybe you should take some of your own advice and chill out.

It's always the same when a new challenge comes along: people look at the numbers and form opinions. There are many other things that affect an overall attack - the least of which is what buffs the enemy has implemented. We can bitch and moan all we want about how an attack might go but until we have some solid attacks in a few weeks/months, it's all opinions.
And until we get that in-game data, many of us appreciate the people who take the time to bring us this 'math crap'.

The biggest problem with additions to the game is not the challenge or the new metas or crafting different buffs, it's that some people don't want to change or try something new. It's all just too hard to have to re-think ...

I am very chill I was saying their crying both sides O and D
Thanks for reminding me lol As devalue it works like this to accomplish what most folks have in 8 years to can now be accomplish in 4 years or less and for half actual money cost. That equal big devalue of older accounts. For a promise of better player pool and without anything tossed to Old Account holder. As I smoke my joint lol

 

[King Crimson]

I am very chill I was saying their crying both sides O and D
Thanks for reminding me lol As devalue it works like this to accomplish what most folks have in 8 years to can now be accomplish in 4 years or less and for half actual money cost. That equal big devalue of older accounts. For a promise of better player pool and without anything tossed to Old Account holder. As I smoke my joint lol

LOL - What you're describing is not a devaluation - it's sour grapes. Your base is exactly the value you spent on it - both time & money.
Do you boycott the Walmart store that sells a tv for half the price you bought it 8yrs ago?? It's called evolving.
Keep smokin' ...

 

[Seek]

LOL - What you're describing is not a devaluation - it's sour grapes. Your base is exactly the value you spent on it - both time & money.
Do you boycott the Walmart store that sells a tv for half the price you bought it 8yrs ago?? It's called evolving.
Keep smokin' ...

Alright there smart guy it is devalue. Might wanna keep it about game. I am not being rude to you but I can be .