Assault Rally tactic - Appears to be REDUCING troop DPS at higher AR levels

yemen

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Mar 24, 2017
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So, another player reported that the upgraded assault rally appeared to cause his troops to do LESS damage per second and move slower as it was leveled up. So I got some alliance members with different levels of assault rally together, and did some testing.

Testing scenario - 1 maxed heavy rpg, friendly challenge, rallying on level 16 walls. repeating the rally as soon as it ran out or the wall was destroyed. AR Levels 1, 2 and 3.
Level 1 - 6 shots, fired once per second broke through the wall. ~18 seconds to do three walls.
Level 2 - The shots fired half as often (every 2 seconds) and it took ~26 seconds to do three walls.
Level 3 - fired even slower than level 2 (between 2 and 3 seconds) and took over 10 seconds per destroyed wall section. 33 seconds to do three walls.

So the upgraded tactic did noticeably less damage, took longer to fire (slower attack rate), and was also slower to break through the walls (lower damage per second - not sure if the damage per shot was up or down, as the shots were so much slower).

This feels similar to the original problem with the protect values on the assault rally, just on the offensive side. If there is going to be an attack speed penalty as we level this tactic up, that needs to be explicitly called out. As it currently stands, upgrading it is a tradeoff - better protect, but worse damage per second and slower troops. Not necessarily a good tradeoff.

And level 4 would be the worst case - no better protection, worse attack speed and dps if the pattern continues.

Other players, can you test in your own alliances and confirm the pattern?

TinSoldier BHG_Muet Can you verify whether this is the intended behaviour? And if it is, change that fact to be called out very explicitly in game? As it stands, this is the only tactic, troop or upgradeable offensive item I am aware of in game that has stats that make it WORSE as it is leveled up. My reading of the stats is that it should BOOST speed, damage and attack speed. As it is, it appears to be REDUCING it by those factors. Which means that level 4 would be the absolute worst, as it would be no better at protect, and worse at everything else.

Edited to add: 2 seconds is the base attack time for a bazooka.
It appears the boost is actually being applied to TIME, as follows.
Level 1 AR - 50% of the base attack time (2*.5), fires every 1 second.
Level 2 AR - 100% of base attack time (2*1.0), fires every 2 seconds.
Level 3 AR - 150% of base attack time (2*1.5), fires every 3 seconds.
Speculative - Level 4 AR - 200% of base attack time (2*2), fires every 4 seconds

My reading of the description is that it should apply to attack SPEED, as a boost. So I would expect the following:
Level 1 AR - 50% addition to base attack speed (150% total attack speed). To get time, that is applied as Base Time DIVIDED by attack speed. So 2/1.5, for a time of 1.3.
Level 2 AR - 100% addition to base attack speed (200% total attack speed). 2/2.0, fires every 1 second.
Level 3 AR - 150% addition to base attack speed (250% total attack speed). 2/2.5, fires every .8 second.
Level 4 AR - 200% addition to base attack speed (300% total attack speed). 2/3, fires every .66 second.

That is how I would take it as the plain english reading. I would guess there was a misreading between the designer who wrote it in plain english, and a programmer who applied it somewhat backwards. As a programmer, I have seen mistakes like this before, very easy to make.

The boosts to attack damage appear to be applied to each SHOT, as a direct multiplier on some base damage number (probably the base DPS*2). This is reasonable, and would probably be very appropriate without the changes to attack time going in the wrong direction. But as it stands right now:
Level 1 AR - 120% damage boost - each shot does 1.2 x base damage. With shots going 2x speed, that means we are getting 2.4x base dps at the moment.
Level 2 AR - 150% damage boost - each shot does 1.5 x base damage. Shots are at 1x speed, so 1.5x base dps - worse than level 1, better than nothing.
Level 3 AR - 180% damage boost - each shot does 1.8 x base damage. Shots are at .67x speed, so 1.2x base dps - worse than level 1 or 2.
Level 4 AR - 200% damage boost - each shot does 2 x base damage. Shots are at .5x speed, so 1x base dps - Worst of any level, and much slower shots than base.

The upshot right now is that it may be worth upgrading from level 1 to 2 or 2 to 3 for the extra protection value and movement speed. Upgrading to level 4 would appear to be a straight up downgrade compared to level 3. I don't recommend that one until they fix this.
 
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Manifesto

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According to the stats increase shown in the armory, everything suggests bonuses are increased, not reduced.
 

shukra

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omg ... i have assault rally level 2 upgrade about ready to complete .. do i cancel it?
can anyone second yemen please?

in our group we have one person with it upgraded to level 2 -- it's just on us to construct an example using walls.
 
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Alexey

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I’m about to finish level 2 upgrade too. I would suggest to do the upgrade - it’s clearly a bug and it will be fixed, you just have to wait a bit. Otherwise you’ll loose 12 days of armory slot - one of the most valuable slots, at least for me.
 

yemen

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Manifesto I agree, that is how I would read it - as designed to increase damage and attack speed as you upgrade it. My point was that in game testing shows it does the opposite. Similar to how they had the protect portion of the assault rally messed up when they first released it. They appear to have programmed it incorrectly, so 50% is multiplied by the base attack TIME, causing the units to attack twice as fast, 100% leaves them at their normal attack TIME, greater than 100% is inceasing their attack TIME. So a bazooka normally attacks every 2 seconds, at level 1 it becomes 1 second (2*.5), at 2 it goes back to 2 seconds (2*1.0), at 3 it does up to 2.4s (2*1.2). I think the intent was to be 150% of regular speed, and then 200%, etc. To do that would be attack time DIVIDED by the percent plus 100. So 2/1.5 for an attack time of 1.33, then 2/2.0 for 1s, then 2/2.2 for .9s, etc.

shukra - I am in the same boat, level two finishes up tonight, and I'm not that excited about the downgrade. But I agree with Alexey - I think this behaviour is a bug they will fix at some point. And I don't want to waste the armory time already invested, so I am going to let it finish. I will be upset if it is a permanent downgrade.
 
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River

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yemen We did many tests too in my clan!

With AR lvl 3 on 1 heavy tank and after deploy 1 ht and the attack speed/shooting speed was the same!

It took customer service 3 times for them to understand the problem was not duration or if i had the troops in radius or redownload the game...

Finally they took my ticket forward, but i think it is great you create a topic for it.
 

No Angel

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You know, if you run faster than you should, you'll get tired easily...
 

Corne

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Going to have to wait 2 weeks for an official reply from tinsoldier where he will say we are investigating, then they are investigating for 2 weeks, then another 2 weeks before the fix is there.... their bugfixing workers really need a speedup blessing. Or spend some crowns to instantly fix it.
 

GeeGee

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Mar 13, 2016
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Oh great🤦🏻*♂️ Why do I even bother upgrading these things? It’s been the same things over and over again in this game. You establish yourself with a decent combo through hard work, research and time only to then have the rug pulled from beneath you🤦🏻*♂️

I upgraded my Planes and HTs, did all the research I could to make them more ‘meta’ and they mysteriously appear to be nerfed now. Add to that my go-to ‘freemium’ Dock Card - the ROK Army has been nerfed (100dps shooters down to 73dps).

Are we genuinely heading towards a Space Age future where nobody can defeat bases on account of all the defensive rebalances?
 

oddin

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very good analysis Yemen.
SO it all comes down to math. Instead of dividing, they multiplied? That must be the reason I guess...

Well done for finding this bug
 

Rogue Squirrel

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I'm not going to upgrade this tactic until I get some confirmation from someone about what's going on
 

oddin

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επ καλως τον καταστροφεα!!! χαχα
 
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